From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of marcelofamilytx [tmarcelo@austin.rr.com] Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 5:35 PM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Robbins DNA #83639 Hi all, This is kind of a follow-on to Sara's recent question to Val about DNA testing of her Robbins line. I noticed on the Robbins DNA results page, there is a kit #83639. The description of the line tested says: Robbins family - Lincoln Co., Ontario, Canada As I've noted before, there seem to have been TWO different lines of Robbins in Lincoln Co. Ontario. One is the Daniel b. 1765 and his brother Stephen b. 1767. The other is the Daniel b. 1777 who came to Lincoln Co. (Gainsborough) from Thorold Ontario before 1828. Stephen's line seems to be represented by kit #74013. And the markers in that line mismatch #83639 by 3 markers. I'm really curious to see the ancestry of the tester #83639. Because it certainly COULD be a male from the Thorold bunch. Does anyone have a copy of this tester's ancestry? Tracey From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of rer480 [rer480@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 3:07 PM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 Tracey: 74013 is my line. From Stephen Robbins, b. 1768 Now comes the trouble. Research has identified as a son of Stephen, John S.Robbins. The kit 83639 is reportedly from John S. Robbins ancestry. The difference is quite a bit. I have no other way to explain it. And regarding your previous post about the ancestry of Thomas Robins. you are aware of Douglas Robbins of St. Catherine's lineage? http://www.niagara.com/~robbins/robbins.htm From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of marcelofamilytx [tmarcelo@austin.rr.com] Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 8:30 PM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 Wow! Well that really is a puzzlement! I am familiar with Douglas Robbins site. I'm pretty sure he has some of the kids of Daniel b. 1777 mixed up with the kids of Daniel b. 1765. (For example, Daniel D. Robbins and Canby Robbins received property from the Daniel b. 1777. And the Daniel b. 1777 lived with Daniel D in the 1851 census--so I'm pretty certain they are the sons of Daniel b. 1777 and not sons of the Daniel b. 1765.) Very interesting! That the markers are so far off of yours! Do you have the direct line ancestry of the person who donated kit 83639? Is there any possibility that he might have mistraced his line back to John S and Stephen? Which of Stephen's son do you descend from? Not John S, right? Tracey From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of rer480 [rer480@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 10:45 PM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 THere's always error in any genealogy. I'm pretty sure his is as accurate as any. Different mothers though. John S was born in 1799 to Susannah Dils (Diltz) My Mathias was born in 1806 to a Christine ?. I doubt that would make that much of a difference, though. I was going by family sheets provided from an outside source for the John S. Robins connection. It could be wrong. I have sources for the traceback on my side, I can't say for sure the accuracy of his. His line is available on the FTDNA site for registered users only. From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of marcelofamilytx [tmarcelo@austin.rr.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:37 AM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 Right. John left a will in 1868 and named his children as: Jacob Angeline (deceased) Eli Stephen Calvin Hiram Samuel Tester #83639 would have to be descended from one of those sons, unless John had sons that weren't named in the will for some reason. Tracey From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of rer480 [rer480@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 2:29 PM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 His lineage says that he decended from Stephen, son of John S. I can't explain the difference in the Y chromosomes. 1851 Census shows John S as being born in Canada, instead of NJ, as has been reported elsewhere. From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of John German [german@jarman.net] Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 6:20 PM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 I think you are fretting too much over three markers, especially when considering that DYS449 is a very unstable marker that I never worry about; DYS576 is a fast mutator and its results are "all over the place" amongst descendants of Daniel Robins; which leaves DYS464c as just one serious difference, but mutations happen - they are random events. From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of Val [vjean75@hotmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:45 PM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 Just a note: I checked the 1851 census and find that it DOES say John S. Rob(b)ins was born in the U.S. and tht he was 54 years old. The 1861 census is an agricultral census of Gainsborough Lincoln County showing Jacob,Stephen,Eli , John D. Thomas and Cyrus Robins - all formers I guess. From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of marcelofamilytx [tmarcelo@austin.rr.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 7:15 AM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 Hey Val, Did you ever find a Robbins descendant in your line to be tested? Tracey From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of marcelofamilytx [tmarcelo@austin.rr.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 7:36 AM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 Thanks for the explanation. Knowing all of that, it seems deciphering the results is more complicated than I thought! Also, just wanted to mention, I think the 3rd mismatch between these two tests is a 2-step mismatch (one is 19 the other 21) at marker 576--not 464c. (The chart at http://homepages.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~tamara/RobbinsSurnameDNAProject.html has the differing markers highlighted and makes it a bit easier to follow.) Thank goodness in this case we had a paper trail to tell the story! Tracey From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of val king [vjean75@hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 9:34 AM To: robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 No I didn't look for any. I'm not sure how it works. Does the person have to go to the US.? Does it have to be a male? Does it have to be a Robins? P.S. sorry for the typos in the last e-mail.. They were farmers not formers and it was an agricultural census. I shouldn't do this late at night. Val From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of Sara Hoffman [july37@cox.net] Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 9:55 AM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 Val, Unless you missed my previous question to you posted on 9/25? I'm assuming your lack of response regarding Frances w/o Wm. Potter & her maiden name being Child is a "NO", that you don't have a reliable source for her surname Child? Sara From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of marcelofamilytx [tmarcelo@austin.rr.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 10:17 AM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 Go to the project page at: http://www.familytreedna.com/public/Robins/default.aspx There is a link to an FAQ section: http://www.familytreedna.com/faq/ No -- you don't have to go to the U.S. It's done through the mail. Yes -- the person being tested has to be a male Robbins. I'm sure the project administrators could help you. But you would have to know a male Robbins who would be willing to be tested. Tracey From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of val king [vjean75@hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 10:23 AM To: robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 HHHMMM. I don't know any male Robins. Can it be a Robins descendant? My son or brother? Val From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of val king [vjean75@hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 10:37 AM To: robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 I've looked at the site you recommended. It says that the DNA test should be through father,father, father. My Robins ancestor is father, mother, father. (My grandmother was Mary Robins, her father was Job Robins, his father was Joshua Robins, his father was John Robins - the "brick wall" ). So how would that work? Also it talks about cost but doesn't say what the cost is. Val From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of marcelofamilytx [tmarcelo@austin.rr.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 10:38 AM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 No. It has to be a male descendant through all the males. So... Mr. X Robbins his son his grandson his great-grandson his great-great grandson and so on... Any male descendant who descends solely through the Robbins males. Tracey From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of John German [german@jarman.net] Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 10:50 AM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 The difference at 576 could be two one step mutations from a value of 20 - one sample has deleted to 19 and the other has increased to 21. I'm not saying that is what happened, but wanted to point out the possibility. And as I said in my previous post, the values of this fast mutating marker are all over the place amongst descendants of Daniel Robins; matches are of course better than mismatches but in this example I would not worry too much about it. From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of val king [vjean75@hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 10:56 AM To: robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 OK thanks. I'll just have to find another way. Back to researching at the library!! Val From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of rer480 [rer480@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, October 01, 2009 9:49 AM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 Did your grandmother have any brothers? Did they have sons? It's the same as if you had a direct lineage. Do a little research and see if there's any living relatives of the male variety. Works the same as if you have a direct male lineage, same DNA. The costs are less in joining the Robbins group at Family Tree DNA. A simple initial test is like 99 dollars of so, just establishes the first From: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com on behalf of rer480 [rer480@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, October 01, 2009 9:54 AM To: Robbinsfamilysouthjersey@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Robbinsfamilysouthjersey] Re: Robbins DNA #83639 Did your grandmother have any brothers? Did they have sons? It's the same as if you had a direct lineage. Do a little research and see if there's any living relatives of the male variety. Works the same as if you have a direct male lineage, same DNA. Trick is getting them to give you a sample, but really, if there is someone in the family that does genealogy research, that might not be that hard. The costs are less in joining the Robbins group at Family Tree DNA. A simple initial test is like 99 dollars of so, just establishes the first 12 or so markers. Enough to establish a pattern that can be checked against the results.